Curse

Evilsod · Oct 28, 2006, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sid Soggybottom

And what's so heroic about roasting a crowd of monsters who just stand there and let you burn them to death?

And why do we need a dozen threads complaining about the AI popping up everyday now?

Tearing through mobs because they let you burn them to death is slightly more heroic than spending entire trips chasing things around in circles. Its also alot more fun.

While doing Elona Reach (properly) the Monk boss fled into a corner, getting bodyblocked, taking us 10 minutes to kill. Why 10? Because spirit AI is ****ing pathetic. I stood there with Attuned was Songkai on and they would spam attack the Monk soss, then for no reason at all change to hit a ranger. Then we came across the Mesmer boss, who never actually attacked us, it cast 2 spells then started to run around.

I don't want to have to bring Deep Freeze just to make the frigging enemies stand still for a change. If i wanted enemies to flee constantly i'd play more PvP. I'm not saying everything should stand in AoE until death... but this is just stupid. Its like the problem with animated undead standing in AoE. We came to accept it, they attacked relentlessly, now they spend most of there time running off. Even if Anet have commented on it, its just retarded, if they don't know how things are gonna react to updating 3/4 of the game then don't ****ing do it!

Blackest Rose · Oct 28, 2006, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Sid,
No one is saying that we want them to be standing there doing nothing but today they take one hit and run away. This is a problem.

In PVP does a warrior take one hit and then run away? No - tanks are tanks.
They are supposed to fight until in danger of dying.

It makes complete sense that if a monster is low on health that they run away and that's what the update notes say but that's not whats happening.

Thank you Rhedd - I was hoping to not be alone here....
And I agree I hope anet recognize this implementation as a bug and fix it.

Reza · Oct 28, 2006, 12:14 AM // 00:14

i dont see any fun in duo UW farming

saphir · Oct 28, 2006, 12:16 AM // 00:16

Hmm, fundamentally the AI seems to be exhibiting 2 different type of behaviors post-update. I have not had the time to do any testing, but it seems that certain players with their particular play styles are experiencing a single enemy monster either running away continuously or pursuing a player continuously.

Other players have experienced the exact opposite, a group of enemy monsters that focus fire solely on one player, generally the warrior, and just keep whacking on him until they are quickly burned to death by the other players. The enemy may run outward from aoe, but will just as quickly run back into aoe to be quickly destroyed. It is as if the rest of the party does not exist to the mobs except for the single warrior.

The only difference I've been able to see so far between the two AI behaviors is single player/single player w/ henchies/hero or dual players vs a sizeable party of players. Also when there is a single or dual enemy vs a entire group of enemies, the single will run around a lot, the group will not.

something just seems very broken

Blackest Rose · Oct 28, 2006, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Reza - That's completely ok but let me ask you if running around trying to catch a monster after hitting it once is fun?

And you need to do this with every monster....

Sid Soggybottom · Oct 28, 2006, 12:25 AM // 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackest Rose

Sid,
No one is saying that we want them to be standing there doing nothing but today they take one hit and run away. This is a problem.

In PVP does a warrior take one hit and then run away? No - tanks are tanks.
They are supposed to fight until in danger of dying.

It makes complete sense that if a monster is low on health that they run away and that's what the update notes say but that's not whats happening.

Thank you Rhedd - I was hoping to not be alone here....
And I agree I hope anet recognize this implementation as a bug and fix it.

I havent had monsters run away from just one hit of a sword like you described. Of course, that doesnt mean it's not happening to you though. But for the most part, people are simply complaining that monsters no longer just stand there to get killed.

In PVP, a warrior most likely won't run away after taking a hit. But any other class WILL kite. A squishy caster in PVP certainly won't let someone bash on him without running away. Heck some people will pre-kite you even before you reach them. Not everyone in PVP is a "tank" and not every monster should be a tank.

Anyway, unless monsters are running away into the next country to the point where you cant even catch them, there really is no problem. Now snares will find some use in PVE. That is all.

Blackest Rose · Oct 28, 2006, 12:29 AM // 00:29

The funniest thing of all Sid is that it was the tank monster that took one hit in my game last night and then ran away.....

The squishies I hacked to pieces and they stayed exactly where they were even when low on health.

It's all very strange and looks to be broken....

Doesn't it make more sense that tank monsters actually are less susceptable to running away and healers, mes and necro monsters more....

The hour or two of playing last night showed quite the opposite.

w00t! · Oct 28, 2006, 01:39 AM // 01:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackest Rose

This is not a rant - it's an observation that because of the latest update monsters seem to run away way too much.

Cripple.

Adapt.

Hyper Cutter · Oct 28, 2006, 02:07 AM // 02:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackest Rose

The funniest thing of all Sid is that it was the tank monster that took one hit in my game last night and then ran away.....

The squishies I hacked to pieces and they stayed exactly where they were even when low on health.

It's all very strange and looks to be broken....

Doesn't it make more sense that tank monsters actually are less susceptable to running away and healers, mes and necro monsters more....

The hour or two of playing last night showed quite the opposite.

I suspect that was done because melee monsters are popular farming targets...

lacasner · Oct 28, 2006, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Man, in all honesty the fun has been nerfed a long time ago..

Greedy Gus · Oct 28, 2006, 02:53 AM // 02:53

So monsters finally did lern2kite?

What a silly notion, enemies that don't want to die? -_-

Emik · Oct 28, 2006, 02:59 AM // 02:59

Well i must say all the 'cripple', 'snare' kind of comments are working a bit on my nerves. And that oh so old comments of 'And in PvP blabla...'
PvP is NOT PvE. if you think you can compare any PvP build with a PvE one then so be it. I must say i wonder how you'd survive.
If people complain about monster AI and in masses this is not a made up isssue.
All the comments here i've read are about adapting and other useless info.
Ok. we know this already.
I too farm occasionally and yeah it's actually challenging to have to calculate what enemy gets what hex over him etc. but chasing an enemy over an entire map is not an excuse to come and start having a bash at the OP becoz he should 'adapt'.

Xinox · Oct 28, 2006, 03:20 AM // 03:20

Try chasing avicara who naturally run faster then you.. only to attack you in the back if you don't chase them.

Lex Talionis · Oct 28, 2006, 03:36 AM // 03:36

Yep stupid indeed. Running away from a mob and having one enemy out've the entire group follow you even as you sprint the hell away is annoying (while testing all I did was try to run past them without attacking/targeting). If it's a melee target or a caster, it will follow you. Then the rest of the mob comes to your location forcing you to fight them. Soon as you attack it, it runs away and comes back again. WTF?? Waste of time.

Last I checked not every creature had sprint/charge/rush/illusion of haste/windborne speed etc. Yet they run after you as if they did. If thats the case, please get rid of all running skills and let everyone just run (if monsters can have invisible speed buffs, so should we). Otherwise what is the advantage?? I love how everyone says adapt without considering the facts. This isn't normal. Don't tell me every creature in this game can catch up to anyone who's using a speed buff skill without activating one in their own list of skills programming. And for RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOs sakes please don't compare pvp to pve.

I truly hope this is nothing more than a glitch and gets fixed.

mqstout · Oct 28, 2006, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Yeah if this is really how it works now... kthxbye. I'll have to test.

Vahn Roi · Oct 28, 2006, 03:43 AM // 03:43

This has been causing a lot of overaggro with henchies today.

LuckyGiant · Oct 28, 2006, 03:48 AM // 03:48

It pisses me off when people comment without actually testing anything, play some PvE and then put some useful into into the thread. Simply saying adapt, stop crying etc doesn't help anyone, especially if some of these so called 'cry' threads hold truth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Update - Wednesday October 25

Improved Monster AI
Monsters no longer run from AoE damage when they are very healthy, or when they think they’re very close to killing their opponent.
Melee monsters are more intelligent about keeping themselves spread out, so that they don’t put themselves into a position where they’re highly susceptible to AoE attacks.

From my experience, the extract from the update notes Improved Monster AI does not appear to be working in the intended way.
-Monsters are running when they have full hp once they get hit
-They engage targets they cannot see (ie: someone holds aggro, someone else is miles away who they will go straight for)

cheeze123 · Oct 28, 2006, 04:18 AM // 04:18

To me, one of the aspects of this patch is to encourage more teamplay. Well personally, I HATE IT. I don't like farming or grouping with other people... mostly because I like the challenge of relying upon myself and to take on hoards of monsters all at once like a godly hero(good ol d2 days). For people who enjoy playing the game solo (like me), the update really kills what fun i have left after i complete all missions and quests (not to mention the low level cap, which to me is one of the reasons that makes this game short). The new patch made this game very slow, boring, and relatively hard (though it is possible) to solo and kill high level mobs.

Now I realize why they might want to nerf solo farming because of some apparent reasons... This is a problem in most online games already, so it's nothing new. Why not just implement a better system for finding cheaters? Something like the warden system blizzard has. Nerfing farming for everyone doesnt necessary make the game better. Not to mention now some skills become rather useless in pve gameplay.

To me, farming is a important aspect in online role playing games... It provides somewhat of an replay value. It's what makes these games so addicting because people need to be able to find a source of income to afford expensive items... the satisfaction of being able to buy something cool... Yes you people can say I'm being materialistic, but what's the point in playing a role game if you can't make your character cool??

As you can probably tell, i'm not really that big into pvp, although I do play it sometimes. But I mean, pvp gets boring for me after a short period (kinda like... cs? i dunno). I find myself quitting this game regularly because of the lack of replay value. I'd stop for weeks or months at a time. I dunno about you... but the last chapter was REALLY SHORT... Now i'll admit that I am planning to try out NF... but i'm not too sure I will continue to do so in the future if I can't continue to find satisfaction in replay value.

However, being the optimistic person that I am... I'm sure that ANET will try to invent new ways of solving this issue and making everyone happy.

crimsonfilms · Oct 28, 2006, 04:22 AM // 04:22

IMO people are just getting confused and frustrated because of tactical atrophy.
That is what you get for farming mindlessly with the same skill for the pass several months.

Sid Soggybottom · Oct 28, 2006, 04:39 AM // 04:39

Ok I gave it a few more hours of playing into the campaign, with henchies and heroes only I might add, and I still dont get what the fuss is about. Seriously, I dont see where the frustration is coming from. It really is harder but NOT THAT hard. It made PVE go from mind numbingly boring to actually somewhat fun.

The A.I. did indeed run around a lot more, but snares helped fine. And also you yourself have to kite a lot due to the warriors running erratically towards the backline at times. Sorry folks, I still dont see what the fuss is about.